Stub axle bolt loose

[califkid_66]

Went for a ride and driver side wheel had a lot of camber thought it was my heim joints but the wheel was moving a lot I tried to see what was wrong I noticed the bolt on the stub axle was moving slightly even though there’s the fold up washer so I unfolded the washer and turned the bolt by hand everything was loose so I thighten the bolt
What could have caused the bolt to be loose it was locked in could the stub axle have stretched

[gideon]

Part, or parts of the assembly have deformed so as to reduce clamping pressure and with reduced clamping pressure the nut becomes loose.  It could be that the stub axle has stretched a little, but more likely that large spacer has deformed where it contacts the inner bearing. Or maybe both.  It's a good job you noticed it before the wheel came off.

There has been a lot of discussion about this problem - Here is one thread you could read that covers a lot of relevant ground.

https://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=4460.msg

[BDA]

In reviewing the thread gideon linked to, S2Zetec54 misunderstood a suggestion I made. I explained it at the end of that thread but I'll try to give a brief description of my method of locking the stub axle nut here:

First torque the stub axle nut properly. Then drill a hole AXIALLY (in the same direction as the stub axle) through the threads of the stub axle and the nut. Tap that hole for a 10-32 or 8-32 set screw or grub screw and screw the set screw into the new hole. The set screw will have to shear in half for the nut to move at all.

[Dilkris]

First torque the stub axle nut properly. Then drill a hole AXIALLY (in the same direction as the stub axle) through the threads of the stub axle and the nut. Tap that hole for a 10-32 or 8-32 set screw or grub screw and screw the set screw into the new hole. The set screw will have to shear in half for the nut to move at all.

Indeed this subject has been well discussed within the forum but I never read that technique - clever.
Is it easy remove the set screw when you come to have to disassemble the stub axle and did you also use Loctite on the splines ? 

[Dilkris]

Refer S2Zetec54 post "Outboard Drive shaft S2 left hand thread? posted on: Wednesday, April 21, 2021, 10:36:35 PM

[BDA]

First torque the stub axle nut properly. Then drill a hole AXIALLY (in the same direction as the stub axle) through the threads of the stub axle and the nut. Tap that hole for a 10-32 or 8-32 set screw or grub screw and screw the set screw into the new hole. The set screw will have to shear in half for the nut to move at all.

Indeed this subject has been well discussed within the forum but I never read that technique - clever.
Is it easy remove the set screw when you come to have to disassemble the stub axle and did you also use Loctite on the splines ?

I won't take credit (or blame) for the idea. A machinist/engine builder friend did that when he pressed my stub axles in when I first was building my car. I liked the idea so I did it again when I rebuilt the uprights a year or so ago.

Taking out the set screw was easy. I didn't use Loctite on it but if I had, I would have used blue. The downside is that you can only drill that hole so many times. I figure you might need new stub axles anyway if you've got too many holes in the end of your stub axle. Of course, it might work out that a hole in the stub axle and the nut would line up when the torque was just a little higher than specified in which case you could be comfortable reusing the hole.

I did use the proper Loctite on the splines - 365 if I remember. r.d. enterprises sells small bottles of it which is handy. I did not use Loctite on the nut, of course.

[califkid_66]

   I just torqued it and locked up the washer for now  the wheel still has a lot of camber

 I made my own adjustable links but the hein joints wear out and get loose so I’m gonna adjust them
   Im planning to change the bearings maybe get the uprights sleeved and get quality hein joints with rubber covering to protect from dirt but for now I’m just going to enjoy it for the summer

I did’nt know you had to put Loctite  on the splines but that would make  sense when the bolt was loose I had movement  I could turn my axle just very slightly where the wheel bolts on and the half shaft didn’t move there was some loose in the splines but after tightening it up no movement between them
   

[cazman]

If I remember correctly, in Dave Bean's catalog he says not to bother sleeving the bearing housing as it usually does not work out well, because of lack of material thickness. The Loctite on the splines is to reduce fretting on properly mated splines, which as I understand, leads to problems like you are experiencing. With the looseness of the hub to the axle as you describe, you may be beyond acceptable specification already.

I do not know if there are measurements to take, rather than feeling that the splines are loose but if there were that could be helpful.

[califkid_66]

Once I tightened the bolts there was no movement in the spline
As for sleeving the reason was if the bearing seat is damaged usually sleeving would solve the problem
But another option would be to just weld the damaged section of the seat and machine it back to speck
I also heard putting loctite before installing the bearings so they don’t move

 For now it seems ok I had a post a while back mentioning that the car jerked when I let go the clutch I think the loose nut was the reason it stopped doing that after tightening the bolt

[BDA]

I would be wary of welding the upright. I understand they are heat treated and (if I'm right) welding them would destroy the heat treatment. I've heard of others sleeving bearing bores. I used Loctite on mine and they seem fine. You must use the proper Loctite - 680, I believe.

[califkid_66]

I’m just checking my options when I disassemble them I will have a better idea of what to do
I was even thinking of fabricating my own uprights with brackets to fit to a twin link
I had my Europa for a couple of years always kept it original I did replace my cooling fan with a spal fan made such a big difference and don’t have cooling problems anymore so I’m keeping the original parts but improving some of them I can always put the original parts back on

[BDA]

Without getting into a discussion about modifications vs keeping it original, I can't see the sense in keeping a part - especially a part like a fan - just to keep it original when there are better examples to be had.

I've seen twin link designs that don't require modifying the upright (the upper link mounts on the radius arm or similar). There's a thread started by Richard Mann from Oz who describes his setup (but the outer attachment of the upper link isn't shown in a picture) here (https://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=1724.msg15757#msg15757). You can also go to the LotusEuropa groups.io group where there are many photos of different twin link designs - one includes a fabricated upright which is an idea I think makes a lot of sense. I think this link should get you a list of pictures that include twin link rear suspensions: https://groups.io/g/LotusEuropa/photosearch?p=Name%2C%2Ctwin+link%2C20%2C1%2C0%2C0&jump=1. And then there is Europa Engineering's twin link which you might use as a starting point for your own design: https://www.lotus-supplies.com/parts/suspension/rear-corners/twin-link-rear-suspension-system-kit-s1-s2/

[SwiftDB4]

If your axle and hub splines are a loose fit you're going to have to get new parts. Loctite will work for awhile, but is not a long term solution.
With new axles and hubs use red loctite to prevent future wear.
If the bearings are a loose fit in the upright your options are:
1. New uprights available from UK suppliers although some are out of stock now.
2. Sleeve upright. I had mine done with thin steel sleeves by a guy in Michigan many years ago. They are holding up well.
3. Fabricate your own uprights.
Again loctiting loose bearings will not hold up long term. I fabricated my own twin link similar to Richards and it has improved longevity of parts.