Out put Shaft Seal

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My passenger side output shaft seal has been leaking and I'm in the process of replacing it.  My mechanical abilities are okay but have never gotten involved with pressing seals in and out and I'm a bit apprehensive.  The transaxle is a 5 speed on my 73 TCS.
I was able to press out the old seal and metal seat it sits in and am now going to put the new parts back together.  This is where I'm lacking in experience.  Since the nut holding all of this into the casing is unavailable, I don't want to do anything that would damage my original nut.  I have a backup I got from the Renault website in case anything goes wrong, but using it would necessitate removing the transaxle from the car and doing the internal adjustments.  This is what Rob Siegel(The Hack Mechanic) had to do and I would really like to avoid that effort.  So I need some help and any suggestions are appreciated.

In the first picture below I have, starting with the socket and going clockwise, the socket, the new seal, the old seal and the metal seat the seal sits in.  The OD of the new seal is 1 1/8" or 54.50 mm,  the OD of the old seal is 1 3/16" or 52.0 mm and the ID of the metal seat is 1 1/64" or 51.7 mm.  So the difference between the metal seat ID and the new seal OD is  2.80 mm.  My thought is to heat the metal seat in boiling water and after having greased up the OD of the seal, try to get it into the seat.  I don't have any other ideas.

Second question deals with the process of putting all of this together.  In the second picture, it can be seen that the socket conveniently fits neatly into the slot on the backside of the seal.  So, do I press the seal into the seat first and then press both into the nut or do I press all three together at once.  Seems to me that the first method is the way to go but I don't have any experience to draw upon.  Could also be a third method I don't know about.

That's where I'm at and appreciate any suggestions.

Thanks!

[TurboFource]

Your numbers don’t convert correctly …1.125” = 28.57mm( Looks like you are off an inch)….. regardless, 2.8mm (.110”) is quite a press fit(something will break)!
Why is new seal a different OD?

[EuropaTC]

I'm another one struggling with the dimensions, on what's given the old seal is larger than the new one and much larger than the seat diameter. I know you can get swelling in some rubbers but I've not seen that sort of dimensional change in a rubber that's correct for the application.  If the numbers are right then you're going to need far more than 100C to expand the housing enough to press it in without risking damage.

I've never had to use heat to fit rubber seals before, are you certain you've been given the correct parts for the transaxle ?

Brian

[Footer]

Sorry guys, I can't explain what happened other than I screwed things up, badly.

Went back and remeasured, getting these results

New Seal = 2 1/18" or 53.97 mm
Old Seal = 2 1/32" or 51.90 mm
Seal Seat = 2 1/32" or 51.59 mm,  OD of the seat is 54.05 mm

I got the seal from Ray at RD Enterprises and they have never sent me inappropriate parts.  This new one is also higher than the old one but I didn't measure it for comparison and I don't think the thickness is significant given the recess on the back side of the assembly.

In the picture below I placed the new seal on top of the seal seat and their ODs appear to be very close.  The wall thickness of the seat is 1.11 mm.

Given these new measurements I've still got a difference of 2.38 mm.

I do have a complete assembly(Nut, seal and seat) that I got from the Renault shop in Denmark.  I could dissemble that one and compare the seal it came with.
 

[TurboFource]

Doesn’t the seal fit inside the threaded bearing retainer nut (A074 F 6045Z)?
What is the steel sleeve ( I don’t see it in the manual, and don’t recall it in my 352 gearbox which shows the same seal in the manual)?

[jbcollier]

This is a metric transaxle.

New seal is 54mm OD

Old steel seal seat is 54mm OD.

Just use the new seal.

Push on the OUTER edge of the new seal.  Remember to lightly grease the seal lip on install.  Change the seal run o-ring as well.

[jbcollier]

I put a smear of Permatex Aviation Gasket Maker #3 on the outside of the new seal.  Helps it to slide in.

[EuropaTC]

I'm another one puzzling over this because I don't recognise the carrier you have there, but in my defence I've got a 352 transmission and not the 365.

It's a few years since I replaced the output shaft seals but I looked up the part I bought and apparently it was  ID 36mm, OD 54mm, 11mm wide, which is roughly in line with what you have there. There is a small O ring just in front of it which I also replaced but I didn't measure that one.

From what I remember I just pressed the seal into the finned nut/carrier the same way John says, pressing on the outer edges of the seal where it's stiffest. I also used a smear of sealant which probably acted as lubricant but otherwise it just slipped in place. I don't remember a separate carrier and looking at the Lotus parts manual for the 365 I'm not sure where it's listed.

I'm actually wondering if someone has fitted a different seal in the past and modified a carrier to suit. Or maybe the finned nut has a damaged seat surface and the steel insert was to correct it ? Whatever the answer, as you've shown in the photo that new seal isn't going to go into that 52mm steel carrier without damaging something, most likely shredding the outer rubber on the new seal.

Brian

[RafM]

I'm in the process of rebuilding a 352, there are two types of oil seal shown in the Renault manual.

The seals are all marked with their sizes, old and new. The only difference is that the new one I'm fitting
is 7mm rather that 11mm thick.

The new seal looks to be an extremely tight fit, I plan on warming them up in hot water and using some lube to get them in undamaged
if possible.

Raf.

[Footer]

The seals are all marked with their sizes, old and new. The only difference is that the new one I'm fitting
is 7mm rather that 11mm thick.

RafM,  You might want to recheck those dimensions as my new seal is 11 mm and the old one is 7 mm thick or high.
I checked with George and Ray at RD Enterprises and they told me the new seal(11 mm) is intended to be used without the steel seat, so you'd end up with a two piece assembly rather than a three piece  as my old one was.  In hind sight, that's probably what jbcollier meant when he said "Just use the new seal., in an earlier post, although I didn't understand it at the time.

I was able to fit the new, 11 mm seal directly into the threaded nut that holds the bearing in place with little trouble.  It's now installed and everything is buttoned up waiting to refill the transaxle and give it a test ride.  Probably tomorrow.

I'd like to post some pictures but am having trouble downsizing them .  The old Paint program was changed to Paint 3d during an upgrade and I haven' yet figured out how to use it for resizing.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. 

[Fotog]

About resizing photos:  I haven't used Paint 3D, but I have found that it's easiest to work in terms of pixels.  Much easier than working in  some percentage, since that will give varying results depending upon the resolution of the original.

800-900 pixels wide works well- gives good resolution and allows the picture to be seen completely. 
Photo shows "old Paint" resizing.

Some huge photos require viewers to pan around the picture to see the entire thing.

-Vince

[Footer]

Thanks Fotag,  I did some digging and discovered that Paint remains on my desktop but you have to search for it.  Evidently the upgrade did not do away with it but simply added Paint 3D and took away it's listing and icon on the desktop.

Here's a sample .

[RafM]

I understand what you mean.

There seems to be be a few variations with the seals, but from the look of it any combination will work.
As I showed in the photos, the seal I removed from the metal/felt ring was 54mm, but I think a replacement seal of
52mm seal would work just fine and they are available.

54mm is a very tight fit, a special took should be used to press it into the carrier.

The seals are all marked with their sizes, old and new. The only difference is that the new one I'm fitting
is 7mm rather that 11mm thick.

RafM,  You might want to recheck those dimensions as my new seal is 11 mm and the old one is 7 mm thick or high.
I checked with George and Ray at RD Enterprises and they told me the new seal(11 mm) is intended to be used without the steel seat, so you'd end up with a two piece assembly rather than a three piece  as my old one was.  In hind sight, that's probably what jbcollier meant when he said "Just use the new seal., in an earlier post, although I didn't understand it at the time.

I was able to fit the new, 11 mm seal directly into the threaded nut that holds the bearing in place with little trouble.  It's now installed and everything is buttoned up waiting to refill the transaxle and give it a test ride.  Probably tomorrow.

I'd like to post some pictures but am having trouble downsizing them .  The old Paint program was changed to Paint 3d during an upgrade and I haven' yet figured out how to use it for resizing.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions.

[RafM]

There is also a O ring listed in the parts manual for a 352 gearbox. It was was not present when I stripped my box down.

Does anyone know the size and why it's supposed to be there?