Author Topic: New member, 71 Renault TS project.  (Read 1441 times)

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Offline Richard48Y

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New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 05:34:32 PM »
71 Europa Project acquired via feeBay.

Just bought what HAS to be my final purchased car.
1971 Lotus Europa with an 11-1, 8K+ RPM (Claimed), 1.6 Gordini Cross-flow head conversion, and twin Weber's engine.
Body is only slightly modified for stability at high speed.
I've been trying to get a Europa since the JPS's and first Fiat X19's came out in 1972!
Actually had one, briefly, a few years ago but had to sell before I ever got to drive it. Similar to this one but with Cosmic's. Got something like $1,500 for it including the uninstalled five speed and genuine Ray-Dot mirrors.  ::)

Now that I'm "Retired" so have a certain basic income the plan is to complete all my projects and not sell any that are "Mine" until I die.
Some projects are in fact intended for sale, but NOT this Lotus!
Seems it's already been repainted several times. This time it's going to be the Silver/Blue metallic that Jag XKE's used, or possibly the original Lotus blue.
I have a set of recently acquired Cosmic rims that may replace what is currently on it.

I will be going to Helena MT to get it as soon as I get my truck back together.
If anyone needs parts or a small car transported from the Reno/No. Nevada area to some place along the way let me know.
I'm already scrounging up parts for it, going to get the "Lotus" valve cover as soon as I scare up some more cash.

Learning a bit more about these.
Fiero five-speed can be fit but requires frame mods. Gear ratio's match but internals are different. Some internal parts do interchange.
Gordini cross-flow heads are no longer easy to source, and expensive. So I scored there.
Actually, without the Gordini TS head and Webers I would not have paid the price for such a project.
Good thing I am in rural Nevada as this car would not do well in heavy traffic with it's claimed to be a pretty much race spec ex-Hillclimb engine.
I will fit the rear disc brake conversion that comes with it.

Located a couple of good sources for mechanical parts, but original bumpers and seat upholstery kits appear not so easy.
Fortunate that it seems my door panels are fairly good, hope the seats can be repaired.
But what I most want is to get it into my shop and running.
Paint after mechanical and test drive.
Looking around it seems a pretty high percentage of the Renault powered cars have the Gordini cross-flow heads and Webers.
From what I am able to discern the Gordini should outperform the (Stock) twin-cam's as it is lighter, makes more power*, and revs higher*.
With this high-strung engine my Europa will NOT be happy in city traffic.
Fortunate that I am in a very rural area but I'm going to need a really good radar detector.
I think I may have found a "Loop" for fun driving but will need to add some additional lights for night flying. 
Hope to be able to add driving lights to the air-dam.
The most dangerous road obstacles in Nevada are gawking tourist, drunks, wild horses, cattle, and deer. So lots of light is a must.

*Of course there is always some guy with really deep pockets who spent insane money for bragging rights. But dollar to dollar I'm confident the Gordini is the better engine and it is the one I've always wanted. (Yah, OK, donning a flame suit now).

My Christmas wish list consist of only one item. A Lotus finned aluminum valve cover to fit my engine. Available but expensive, maybe I can scare up a used one from one of the Electric   :WTF: conversions?

I've been studying up on the Europa as best I may while waiting for Forum admin approval.
Have decided that this one does meet my definition of an "Exotic Car". Fairly limited production, performance outweighs comfort, special specification engine (Gordini cross-flow), parts a PITA to get, and knowledge base limited.  

Tires are as new but twenty years old. So the last exotic item will be replacements. Not seeing much in the way of current performance rubber in 175/70-13. Toyo R888 minimum is 185/60. Any suggestions I may have missed?

I see a lot of discussion that infers all Europa owners are pretty wealthy, "Just buy the Spyder chassis and wheels" for one common statement.
I see a lot of altered rear suspensions too, is it still a Europa when the modifications go that extreme?
Admittedly my Europa already has some mods, Gordini head, Webers, front air dam, and parts to add rear disc brakes.
But I really do want to keep it "Day 2", not radically modified. 
It is to be the car I was snubbed out of buying at 17 YOA back in '72.

It seems I do not see any steel bumpers with the car, so now I have to research putting chrome on fiberglass replacements. Probably via a "Chrome" wrap? There is rumor of a good "Chrome" paint system but I have not seen samples.
As to tires, it seems some cars tolerate the 185/60's OK and others do not. I absolutely do not want to modify the wheel wells!

Enough yammering for an intro.


Offline jbcollier

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #1 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 09:02:10 PM »
Welcome!

Lots of questions and statements worth pursuing.  Why not start a thread for each one?

I'll try a couple:

Fuego (Renault) not Fiero (Pontiac) for the transaxle.  It's physically a bit larger, and also a stronger, transaxle than the stock 336/352/365 units.  Though first is too low for a car the weight of a Europa.

As the old tuner said when asked how fast could you make it go, "How much $$$ have you got.  The Renault wedge seems to top out, after spending a lot of money, in the 140 to 150 range.  Quite fragile and intractable as well at those levels.  The Gordini/crossflow is quite a bit lighter than the Lotus TC engine.  It also has a longer stroke for a bit more low end torque.  Both seem happiest on the street in the 120hp to 160hp (pushing it for the Renault) range.  Full race easily has both seeing 180+ with both also exceeding 200 in recent years.  Not very tractable nor long lived at those levels though.  Both can swallow heaps of cash and still be stomped by soccer moms in their 300hp mini-vans.

The Renault engines can rev but a steady diet over 7K will lead to short camshaft and follower life.  TC engines can rev very high (9K+) with an application of a very large pile of $$.  Valve guide life isn't long on the stock TC engine and it's quite a bit shorter as the revs rise.

I'd say that both are good engines.  Nod to Renault for light weight and tractability.  Nod to TC for revs and amount of support out there.

Offline jbcollier

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #2 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 09:05:15 PM »
PS: The alloy valve cover is heavier than the stock steel cover.  The alloy cover also requires quite a bit of fettling to get oil tight.

Offline Chuck Nukem

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #3 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 10:21:02 PM »
71 Europa Project acquired via feeBay.

*Of course there is always some guy with really deep pockets who spent insane money for bragging rights. But dollar to dollar I'm confident the Gordini is the better engine and it is the one I've always wanted. (Yah, OK, donning a flame suit now).

I've been studying up on the Europa as best I may while waiting for Forum admin approval.
Have decided that this one does meet my definition of an "Exotic Car". Fairly limited production, performance outweighs comfort, special specification engine (Gordini cross-flow), parts a PITA to get, and knowledge base limited. 

I see a lot of discussion that infers all Europa owners are pretty wealthy, "Just buy the Spyder chassis and wheels" for one common statement.

Welcome to the forum! We are here to help!!

I enjoyed your introduction but I must say that I couldn't disagree more about this take on Europa owners. I am not aware of any other cars besides other old Lotus models that publish the dimensions of the suspension components in the owners manual so that one can verify and recreate the damaged parts if they are sufficiently interested. I would argue that Europa owners are some of the handiest and most inclined enthusiasts out there. There is an absolutely immense amount of information available on this car. You can find accurate drawings for free on the internet of a Europa frame, or if there is a particular feature you need on yours many owners on here will happily take the measurement for you as they have done for me countless times.

I bought my first TCS for $1000 as a college student that had $1050 dollars in my bank account. It was a nightmare shit show and I am still fixing it 8 years later :) I would say on a whole we are far crazier than we are wealthy....

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #4 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 10:35:48 PM »
If the sellers claims are honest (feeBay car!) the engine is already more race than street due to being built for past hillclimb use.
I hope to be able to document that history.
Seller fabricated the equal length headers currently on the engine.
Guy he got the car from built the engine.
Since Helena is only 1,000' lower in elevation than my valley in Nevada I hope the Weber jetting will be very close.
Glad that the car comes with some manuals, and an engine gasket set.
Despite my impatience I should probably tear the engine down and reseal, new rings, new bearings, and check out exactly what cam and pistons are in it.
Not seeing Renault parts as being easily available, but did find a possible source in Canada.
I've owned a Renault engine before, hopped up a Caravelle with R8 Gordini bits back when they were all just funky give-away cars. Parts were still plentiful in the 80's.

I will be interested to see what parts are used for the rear disc brake conversion.
Seems that has been a long sought issue here.

At the moment I am mainly interested in getting it home so that I may begin the refurbishing!

One topic I have not seen addressed very much here would be improving the original chassis strength and rigidity. Not replace, enhance.

Offline Chuck Nukem

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #5 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 11:00:48 PM »
The refurbishing! Get ready for the itchiness that never subsides...

There is a member on here that did a cad model of the S2 frame and performed FEA on it. Not much else has been done with that but I believe he did share the model with some of the users on here. http://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=268.msg1682#msg1682

Check out the TC frame because there were quite a few changes to the rear forks where certain portions were boxed in compared to S2.

I would imagine the best way to make the chassis stiffer is to integrate a roll cage so that you get increased stiffness (and safety!) from the added structure.

As for the rear brakes I have an idea for mine but I have to finish painting my car before I can implement it :)

Most of the systems use a sliding caliper from miata or something similar so that parking brake is incorporated. I am going to machine up a set of brackets to accommodate fixed aluminum calipers on all 4 corners.

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #6 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 11:16:38 PM »
Somewhere around here I have a set of light aluminum sliding calipers from a VW, parking brake included. Wonder if I could make them fit?

Or do what I did for my Jag IRS, Wilwood and separate mechanical parking brakes.
Yep, I do have a tendency to "Mission creep" and make it trick even if not needed.
My smart move for now will be to just use what is provided.

Now that I have full forum access I hope to collect some of the older post for my own use.
I recall seeing a trick roll-cage posted.

I do not name cars, but this one might be "Motivation", as I will be trying to lose about thirty pounds. Both to fit easier and to enhance performance.
Everyone know it is easier to remove weight from the driver than the car!

Offline Chuck Nukem

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #7 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 11:22:06 PM »
Looking forward to your progress!

If you discover the Lotus weight loss secret you may have to write a book on it. I submit "Lotus Eaters" as a working title. 

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #8 on: Monday,October 19, 2020, 11:45:26 PM »
Atkins/Paleo works very well so long as the Motivation is sufficient to prevent any cheating.
A bit hard to keep doing for a long time as the diet gets boring, and any little deviation sets you back.
For exercise I can practice Europa entry and exit!

Offline Clifton

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 03:19:05 AM »

Tires are as new but twenty years old. So the last exotic item will be replacements. Not seeing much in the way of current performance rubber in 175/70-13. Toyo R888 minimum is 185/60. Any suggestions I may have missed?

Nangkank has a narrower tire 175/50/13. R comp tires last a while on light cares. I run BFG Rival-s. A year of Autocross and silly driving has barely touched the tread. With R comps, you'll run out of courage before grip.

https://philstireservice.com/shop/nankang-ar-1/

https://philstireservice.com/shop/toyo-proxes-r888r/

Offline Sandyman

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 04:12:12 AM »
Richard, :Welcome: I am looking forward to your restoration. I am 2 weeks into driving my restored and Spyder Chassied '70 S2. Sounds like you have a great example. The best source for Gordini engine help and parts on this side of the Atlantic is in Montreal Canada. I can't remember his name (several mentions in this forum) but a knowledge of French is an asset. We are all waiting for pictures of your beauty when you get her home.
Sandy

Offline dakazman

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 05:07:39 AM »
 :Welcome:

   Richard...
 
    I believe I have talked to you about a year ago about the sale of a gearbox and some liners. There can’t be many lotus owners in Nevada named Richard.
You mentioned your long racing history back then. I’m glad you found your way here.  Recently retired myself and on a budget , I’ve found the most relaxing way to build a car, or several.
 
Dave from Florida !
Dakazman
 

Offline jbcollier

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 06:04:12 AM »

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 08:32:07 AM »
:Welcome:

   Richard...
 
    I believe I have talked to you about a year ago about the sale of a gearbox and some liners. There can’t be many lotus owners in Nevada named Richard.
You mentioned your long racing history back then. I’m glad you found your way here.  Recently retired myself and on a budget , I’ve found the most relaxing way to build a car, or several.
 
Dave from Florida !
Dakazman
 

No, not me.
My time at the track is sadly very limited and a situation I hope to correct ASAP.

If that was a Fuego 5-speed I wonder if it was the one I let go with my prior Europa project?
Doubt I will ever find another at Pick & Pull.

Offline Richard48Y

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Re: New member, 71 Renault TS project.
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday,October 20, 2020, 08:44:05 AM »
Renault engine parts:

https://www.lotus-supplies.com

https://www.renault16shop.com

High performance stuff:

https://www.lotus-supplies.com

http://www.alpine-america.qc.ca

http://www.mecaparts.com

Salv Sacco on ebay

Now THAT is a very useful list!
Just the sort I joined this forum for.

Currently working on getting a shop built on the home property so that I may cease paying rent on a too small unit in town.
Trying to do 60x40 if I may overcome county obstacles.
With a decent size shop I may finally be properly organized for much faster restoration of my several projects.

Hoping the Europa does not require removing the body from the frame so that it may just be a repair/assembly/paint job.
Anxious to have it on the road by May.