Triumph vs Europa frontsuspension.

[bert knip]

Hi,
I learned that the early Triumph spitfire frontsuspension was used for the Lotus europa.
So I ordered a complete triumph overhaulkit, but to my surprise the polybushings do not fit (to small)
What went wrong? Can anyone help me out?
Regards Bert

[BDA]

I'm not sure exactly which Spitfire front suspension parts are interchangeable with the Europa beyond many parts of the steering rack including the tie-rod ends. I do know the suspension arms and uprights are not the same. I believe the brake calipers are interchangeable. One confusing thing is seeing "Stanpart" cast into some of the pieces which is found on many cast Spitfire pieces.

If you're interested in poly bushings, here's a good place: https://autobush.com//bushes-products.asp?MakeId=4

While the Europa and Elan suspensions are not the same, they share the same front suspension bushings so they will work.

Be careful! Ask here first if you aren't sure.

Edit: I forgot to mention that there are some parts cross references out there: http://www.gglotus.org/ggpart/ggpart.htm and http://lotus-europa.com/manuals/lotuswest/74MC083.html. They do not cover all the interchangeable parts out there but quite a lot of them.

Edit again: Among the MANY web sites you should become familiar with, this one is very useful: http://lotus-europa.com/manuals/. Besides online searchable manuals, it has a lot of information and projects people have documented.

And again! I noticed that the autobush.com site lists Elan anti-roll bar bushes. I'm not sure those would be compatible with the Europa anti-roll bar. It might be worth a phone call to make sure.

[bert knip]

Thank you for quick answer.
Will order the right bushings, Bert

[BDA]

I made several edits in my post. Make sure you read them all.

Good luck!

[jbcollier]

Lotus did not use Triumph front suspension for the Europa.  They did, however, buy some bits from the same place Triumph sourced the Herald/Spitfire front end.  The upright, ball joint and trunnion all cross over.  A-arms and bushings are Europa specific.

The early uprights were used possibly because they are weaker and will bend reducing any unintended forces headed toward the chassis, from curbing for example.  You can fit the later, and stronger, Spitfire uprights as they are dimensionally the same but then prudence around curbs would be the order of the day.

[bert knip]

I have both versions of the uprights, so I will use the stronger ones.
Thanks Bert

[BDA]

The upright, ball joint and trunnion all cross over.

Interesting, JB. At one time, I was looking at Spitfire front uprights on ebay and although they were similar, they were different. Where mine has a bolt on brake caliper mount and steering arm, the Spitfire parts seemed to be one-piece. The hole in the steering arm is horizontal where mine is vertical. That is why I said they were not the same.

Are they different but compatible? Maybe I was looking at the "wrong" versions?

Attached is a picture of a Spitfire front upright that is on ebay at the moment.

[EuropaTC]

That's the later Spitfire upright, the ones we have on our cars are the early ones.  Here's a screenshot taken from Rimmer's website showing the difference. They both have a bolt on steering arm and that horizontal part on the casting is to secure it (I think, never had one myself)

Brian

edit to add - if you're using the upright with the cast caliper bracket then I think you'll need the complete assembly. Just looking at the Rimmer's diagram, the steering arms look different.  From a personal point of view I'd guess the later one has a stronger caliper bracket but limits you to calipers with that spacing unless you can figure out some form of adapter plate.  If you have the later ones then you're free to make up your own caliper mounts at whatever you want, which gives you options on disc/rotor diameter and caliper mounting holes.

[JR73]

In case its of interest....

As JB has mentioned in a few different threads now, the various parts associated to Triumph nowadays where not made by Triumph - these parts are Stanparts (as can be seen on some, such as the front uprights, that have the name displayed to see.) This was part of the Standard Motor Company - a vehicle manufacturer in their own right that had subsidiary companies that made components and even complete engines...The various products were available to purchase and a fair number of other manufacturers did just that - such as Lotus. Essentially a large catalogue of parts to choose from which allowed smaller manufacturers to save on development and manufacturing costs along the way.

They purchased Triumph after the war and over time the Standard name disappeared and Triumph remained.... there is a bit about it on Wikipedia (link below) but I can't find a decent online reference that explains the various elements that made up The Standard Motor Company and includes Stanpart.

British Motor Heritage now own the rights to the names Standard Motor Company and Stanpart amongst others and i think are involved in the continuing manufacture of some parts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Motor_Company

[jbcollier]

The early uprights have separate caliper mounts while the later uprights have them as a part of the upright.  You can use either as a complete assembly as they are dimensionally the same.

The latest Caterhams use a later style upright with a spherical joint at the bottom instead of a trunnion.  These also can be used but also result in a significant ride height reduction.  They can be bought from Canley Triumph.

https://www.canleyclassics.com/suspension-steering-and-brakes

[BDA]

I had always thought the uprights were from Spitfires till I looked for them on eBay and only saw the newer ones. Thanks for the clarification, guys!

[Roger]

To delve a little further into history mention must be made of Alford and Alder, an independent engineering company who developed the well-known uprights and rack and pinion steering. They were bought by Standard in the late 50s.
The Alford and Alder upright was a common component of British racing and sports cars before the Spitfire appeared, having been used in a number of Standard cars for some years, although the version used in the Triumph Herald was the clearest ancestor of the one we know today.

[TurboFource]

JB,
Why the significant ride height reduction with the Canley part?

[jbcollier]

The upright with the spherical joint was not made as a dimensional replacement for the Spitfire/Herald but for the Caterhams.  It works though.  Just have to reset your ride height.