Author Topic: flywheel and clutch weights  (Read 1047 times)

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Offline Pfreen

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flywheel and clutch weights
« on: Friday,March 01, 2019, 12:55:42 PM »
Posted in the photos are the weights of the standard tc flywheel(15lb), 8” pressure plate (10.2lb) and 8” clutch disc (2.36lb)  Also, the Fidanza flywheel(7.9lb), Bean 8.5” pressure plate(8.35lb) and Bean 8.5” clutch disc(2.6lb).

So, the Fidanza flywheel and bigger clutch saves 8.71lbs of engine RPM rotating mass.  27.8 vs 18.85lbs.

I will post the difference in torque and BHP when I put it back together.  The data will be taken from my Iphone app Performance Expert which I discussed in an earlier post.

Online BDA

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #1 on: Friday,March 01, 2019, 12:59:15 PM »
Wow! That's a lot! I was surprised the the new clutch cover was even lighter!  :beerchug:

Offline cwtech

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #2 on: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 05:28:20 AM »
Does a lighter flywheel/clutch assy actually increase HP or torque?

I am under the impression it only allows the engine to rev more quickly.

Offline gideon

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #3 on: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 05:55:07 AM »
Yes and no.  The power available at the crankshaft is the same, but more power is delivered to the wheels because less of that power is used to spin up the flywheel.  So, the peak power measured at the wheels is indeed higher while engine speed is climbing.  The car will accelerate faster, but won't produce more power if measured at a steady rpm on a chassis dyno.



Offline jbcollier

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #4 on: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 06:29:20 AM »
Flywheel/clutch/crank/etc mass stores energy.  This can be an advantage, or a liability, depending on the situation.  While more mass does slow the rate of change, it also provides inertia to dampen engine pulses and provide "momentum" to overcome variations in applied load (minor ups and downs in a roadway for example).  More mass will give a smoother idle and make the vehicle easier to start moving from rest.

I have built semi-race engines (if your engine idles at all, it's not full-race) for the street.  You get a high, lumpy, uncertain idle that requires frequent throttle inputs to keep running.  Starting off from rest is more akin to launching with high throttle inputs and careful use of the clutch.  The vehicle constantly changes speed as the road surface fluctuates.  All this is extremely annoying in busy traffic requiring significant concentration to the engine's continued running that would be better put to minding the surrounding traffic.  It also requires the driver act with a significant level of precision, especially when cornering near the limit.  Clumsy, or careless, inputs results in the vehicle jerking or pogo-ing down the road.

In counter-point, you get a lively, responsive engine that responds instantly to your inputs.  This can be quite intoxicating and gives a strong feeling being one with the vehicle.

When I built my Europa, I knew exactly what I wanted.  I knew that, on the street, a bit more torque in the mid-range is far more useful than a few more hp at 7K.  Higher compression, medium ports with smooth transitions, higher lift with moderate duration and 40 rather than 45 carbs.  I'm very happy with the result.  I get a pretty reasonable idle, easy launching*, plenty of mid-range torque combined with a nice high end hit at 6K.  My flywheel is the slightly larger 215mm with no weight reduction.

* a good portion of which was fitting a hydraulic clutch -- light and smooth as butter.
« Last Edit: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 06:31:18 AM by jbcollier »

Offline gideon

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #5 on: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 07:41:33 AM »
JB - so there's enough friction in the original cable mechanism that a hydraulic clutch is a big improvement?  Also, are there some details of your engine build somewhere?  I might like to refer to that in planning the rebuild of my wedge engine.

Pfreen - it would be good to hear from you what difference the lighter flywheel makes when you get there.  Will it feel a lot faster?  Will it require a lot of extra concentration in traffic?  I'm on tenterhooks!

Offline Pfreen

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Re: flywheel and clutch weights
« Reply #6 on: Saturday,March 02, 2019, 08:44:21 AM »
There is much more on this subject on Lotuselan.net.  Everything I have read says the Fidanza flywheel made no difference in driveability.  I took those mass numbers I measured and approximated the bhp increase.  If you accelerate from 2000 to 6700 RPM in 1 second, you will gain 12 bhp.  My acceration tests using the perf expert app in 2nd gear took around 3 seconds.  So, I expect a 4Bhp increase.  It isn’t a lot but is is 3.5% or so.