Lotus Europa Community
Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: richyb66 on Wednesday,September 04, 2024, 04:02:44 AM
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I'm missing the lower steering column on my S2, the bit that goes from the UJ on the rack to the impact clamp on the column itself.
It looks like it's just a Triumph Spitfire part, can anyone confirm this?
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I cannot confirm either way - but I can access mine (as it is yet to be fitted as my body is off) and photograph it if it helps. I have also just checked and SJ Sportscars do not appear to stock them.
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It's the same as the Elan and from a Club Lotus comparative parts list it's from the early Triumph Herald/Vitesse/Spitfire/GT6. I'd imagine getting something for a Herald from a breaker would be much cheaper than either Spitfire or Lotus ;)
Brian
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Rimmer Bros.
https://rimmerbros.com/ItemList--Triumph-Spitfire-Steering--m-209
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I'd imagine getting something for a Herald from a breaker would be much cheaper than either Spitfire or Lotus ;)
Brian
Its many many years since I have seen a Herald in a UK breakers yard Brian..... :FUNNY:
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Rimmer Bros.
https://rimmerbros.com/ItemList--Triumph-Spitfire-Steering--m-209
Just checked this reference - Wow!! £115.20 + postage. :holdurbreath:
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Found a second hand Spitfire one on eBay for £15.99 including delivery. I'll give that a go.
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Hi i am fairly new to this forum. I am in the same position regarding the lower steering column shaft. Although my original is very useable. It is very pitted with rust marks. So i looked up price from Europa Supplies (Banks) and these are much cheaper £72.00p + vat i think.
However i have decided to make my own rather than use the old one. My stumbling block is the spline detail, as not sure of the spine angle used. Shaft will be hardened and tempered. Got some metal cut to length.
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:Welcome: rogerthedodger!!!
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Iirc that part has equivalent features, but is shorter than those found on a Herald or Spitfire. I have both of those (and one from the Europa) in the garage; will check and see if the lengths make sense to swap directly, or if it requires modification.
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Rimmer Bros.
https://rimmerbros.com/ItemList--Triumph-Spitfire-Steering--m-209
Just checked this reference - Wow!! £115.20 + postage. :holdurbreath:
You forgot the 20% VAT !
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:I-agree:
So its worse!! :-[
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:I-agree:
So its worse!! :-[
Not for Rachel Reeves !
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If the Spitfire or Herald one is too long, any machinist should be able to mill the shaft to the D shape where the clamp goes. And just to confuse people even further, TR6's use a very short version of the lower column, something like 12" long.
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Here ya go, I couldn't find the Spitfire version. You sit further back relative to the steering rack in a Spitfire than a Herald, so that might be even longer than the Herald's.
Bracket section is the D-milled portion.
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Wow, good post, I'd never have expected that amount of difference. I guess the next question is if the S1 is the same as the S2 & later variants ?
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Really helpful photo - so we can now assume that the Europa part is very much a one off correct?
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Hmm, I thought I knew this one as I'd expected it to be the same as the Elan, but now I don't. It's odd, the part numbers in the book are different and I wonder if there's anything about the early cars without steering lock and the later ones with a lock. I can't see how this would affect the lower column but the numbers are slightly different even if the TC does have the type 46 lineage.
S2
046H6005 Lower Column
TC
X046H6003Z Lower column
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The Introduction to the parts manuals describes the part number scheme but I’m not sure how to read those part numbers. I couldn’t find an explanation for the ‘X’ in the TC part number. The ‘46’ in both numbers seems to refer to the car on which that part originally found implying they must be the same part but the S2 part is 6005 while the TC part is 6003. Why would the “suffix” change if it was the same part? I couldn’t find an explanation for the ‘Z’ in the TC part number.
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I'm just as confused but logically if they have different numbers there's probably some difference even if it's minor.
I am surprised that Lotus didn't use an off the shelf part for something like that. Maybe as Roddy posted about the different Triumph columns they used the TR6 (4a for the time ?) part on the S1 and then maybe another Triumph part later when the cabin/seating position was redesigned.
It's Lotus. Who knows what they did back then.....
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I am surprised that Lotus didn't use an off the shelf part for something like that.
It's Lotus. Who knows what they did back then.....
Ditto the steering rack.
I have ordered a new one from Banks/Lotus Surprise, 7 weeks ago......
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I am surprised that Lotus didn't use an off the shelf part for something like that.
Lots of parts that we think of as "Triumph parts" or etc aren't quite that, they're just sourcing from the same supplier. Europa drum backing plates are basically the same as the GT6, but some holes are in different spots. The iconic uprights, steering racks with extensions, etc.
Probably the same idea with this part, it's all the same features and is made with the same tooling, but it doesn't need to be exactly the same. The made a few thousand of these cars not like 10, so some suppliers were willing to negotiate for simple variations, and I'm sure it cost Lotus more than Triumph or whoever.
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I'm just as confused but logically if they have different numbers there's probably some difference even if it's minor.
I am surprised that Lotus didn't use an off the shelf part for something like that. Maybe as Roddy posted about the different Triumph columns they used the TR6 (4a for the time ?) part on the S1 and then maybe another Triumph part later when the cabin/seating position was redesigned.
It's Lotus. Who knows what they did back then.....
Would it be one was supplied with the flexible/rubber universal and the later one supplied with the metal universal or are those parts called out separately (I'm not at my stack of parts manuals).
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Would it be one was supplied with the flexible/rubber universal and the later one supplied with the metal universal or are those parts called out separately (I'm not at my stack of parts manuals).
I don't know Bryan although that makes sense and could well be the reasoning.
From my parts list copy the S1/S2 & later TC/TCS appear to have the same "046" heritage part number based on where it was first used but the remaining numbers are different. I do know that you can swap out the rubber flexible joint for a metal one as I did that on the Elan years ago and the splines/column accommodated the mod but I didn't measure the overall length of the metal UJ or OEM rubber one.
I must admit I'm far more cynical of 1960/70's Lotus than most and I can easily believe that they used whatever they had to hand to get cars down the line. I can hear the conversation now...
"Colin - we can't get Herald columns, they're out of stock"
"what can we get ?"
"TR4"
"does it fit ?"
"just about"
"get 'em in and get the car sold".
They were still doing that in 1999 when I bought a new Elise. That came without the decals showing the switch function on some of the Peugot 105 switches.
"Lotus have a supply problem sir, we've had a couple of cars like that this month. We'll fix it at the first service, but that one on the left is your side lights, the next is the main lights"
Peugot switches and they hadn't got the right ones to build cars...... (they did fix it though)
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I must admit I'm far more cynical of 1960/70's Lotus than most and I can easily believe that they used whatever they had to hand to get cars down the line. I can hear the conversation now...
"Colin, we have run out of credit with those suppliers, and they won't send us any more until the account arrears are paid."
"Can we get credit anywhere else for something similar that we can make to work?"
"I will hunt around and see what we can get."
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I must admit I'm far more cynical of 1960/70's Lotus than most and I can easily believe that they used whatever they had to hand to get cars down the line. I can hear the conversation now...
"Colin, we have run out of credit with those suppliers, and they won't send us any more until the account arrears are paid."
"Can we get credit anywhere else for something similar that we can make to work?"
"I will hunt around and see what we can get."
:)
I'm too much of a sensitive soul to suggest anything like that.....
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I think you both give reasonable scenarios but that sort of thing must have actually happened at Avanti (started as a Studebaker model). They used whatever parts they could find from whatever sources would sell to them. It is so bad that collectors have a hard time proving their car is unmodified. It must have been tough for the designers who had to design the various mounts, brackets, etc.!
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They used whatever parts they could find from whatever sources would sell to them. It is so bad that collectors have a hard time proving their car is unmodified.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uErKI0zWgjg
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Very funny song!! Even funnier that a Brit would point me to it!! :FUNNY:
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My guess is the lower column might have changed slightly where the pinch bolt goes through. One of the columns I have has a groove all the way around, the other has a short groove to keep the UJ/Flex joint it a certain alignment. I'll pull the Elan column down from the shelf this next weekend to see what it has.
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I applaud the idea of making this part, but without a lot of specialised kit I think you will struggle. From my experience as an ex Rolls Royce toolmaker/ universal miller I have made lots of bits over the lasr 30+ years for my supercharged x/flow Westfield, and even considered something along the lines you're thinking for my current TCS, but without either a broaching m/c or a slotting head for a universal milling m/c. you'll have a hell of a job on your hands. But good luck anyway. Just do it up tight!!!
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I applaud the idea of making this part, but without a lot of specialised kit I think you will struggle. From my experience as an ex Rolls Royce toolmaker/ universal miller I have made lots of bits over the laser 30+ years for my supercharged x/flow Westfield, and even considered something along the lines you're thinking for my current TCS, but without either a broaching m/c or a slotting head for a universal milling m/c. you'll have a hell of a job on your hands. But good luck anyway. Just do it up tight!!!
Hi I am fortunate enough to be in a position at work on shifts where we do have the equipment to do such a job. As i am a toolmaker still (nearly retired). I just fancy having a go at it. Still have my old useable old if i get stuck just needs to be painted.
Thanks anyhow.