Lotus Europa Community
Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: Sparkrite on Tuesday,July 12, 2022, 12:02:58 PM
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I am super gutted, I have spent a year and a half getting my car going. I had the gearbox in pieces just days before a faultless 600 mile trip to le mans in france. And my first journey since returning, just 3 minutes from leaving home a stupid woman in a big suv type rear ends me at the lights.
All the back is smashed, part of the boot lid and even the luggage tray. This car was never before in an accident and now its ruined.
What I would like to ask here is advice on the pitfalls of the insurance company that I will deal with. Firstly they are offering to use another company to handle the claim and thus enabling me to not pay the standard £200 excess.
I am suspicious as I have a feeling this will be worse.
Secondly how on earth do I chose who to use for the fibreglass repairs here in the uk. Ive always done my own metal fabrication and painting and knowing the amount of work that goes into bodywork I can understand why so many body repairs are bodged. I am very fussy in this regard and cant see me ever getting a satisfactory result.
I just dont know what to do.
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Man, that's terrible, Sparkrite!! :'(
Sorry I can't help you with navigating your insurance, but hopefully you'll be able to get her repaired and back on the road.
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How awful! :(
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That's terrible. SUVs should be banned.
You might check with the local Lotus parts suppliers. They might know of repair shops near you.
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Very sorry to hear this. Thankfully you are where chassises and bodies are more readily, and less expensively, to hand. I can't help you with UK insurance law and procedures as I'm in Canada. Spyder can supply a chassis, and fit it if need be. They also restore cars so should be able to do the bodywork as well. Complete bodies and repair sections can be had from Boss Motors:
https://www.facebook.com/Boss-motors-1852531295061863/
They have the original factory models AFAIK. They have been advertising in the Lotus Club news since forever and I have only heard good things though I have had no direct contact myself.
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Heck that's bad luck, I feel for you.
Trying to be practical, the first thing is have you got an agreed value insurance on the car ? Most classic policies do have and that would make things easier to argue with the insurance company regarding repairs, etc.
Bodywork isn't so tough, all the parts are available and unless the rules have changed you are within your rights to expect it be repaired at either a Lotus dealer (oh yeah) or approved specialist. Banks are the obvious ones but there are others who do full scale restorations & bodywork.
One thing that does concern me is if the damage is as far as the luggage tray then there could be damage to the rear of the chassis legs. That could prompt an insurance company into declaring it a write off. If they try that route then it's important to make sure it's not classed as a complete write off, never to be rebuilt, etc.
If the other insurance claim it's not economical then there might be the option to buy the salvage and rebuild yourself. Hence the write off category will be important, if only because we don't want another Europa permanently removed.
As for dealing with insurance companies, I am assuming your insurance company is going to claim off the other party ? Although it's many years ago, we were rear-ended at a roundabout (wife's brand new car, less than 200 miles on the clock) and it was the first time I'd ever had to make a claim. In that instance our insurance company appointed a legal firm who gave us loads of forms to fill in, after which it all went away.
The legal bods made sure the 3rd party paid our excess, apparently very important for future insurance purposes, so make sure that happens. They also insisted the car was repaired at the main (supplying) dealer rather than a body shop appointed (approved ? huh ?) by the other insurance company.
So if that's the deal you've been offered, it worked out ok for us. Car back as new, no outlay and they even came back with compensation, something I never thought of. Check out exactly what they're offering and why, it might be similar ?
Brian
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Terrible news and I’m sorry to hear that’s happened.
If you where rear ended then I assume that it has been classed as a ‘no fault’ by yourself? - this is generally the case as the person that hit you from behind is generally considered to be ‘at fault’. If this is the case then you shouldn’t have to pay any excess as the claim will be paid for by the other parties insurance which will cover your excess, any hire car required, injuries etc…. If it is a ‘no fault’ on your part then make sure you get it in writing from the company handling the claim (personal experience here, two years after a ‘no fault’ claim it turned out that the case hadn’t been closed on the insurance database by the company that had to pay out and I spent about two weeks chasing around to get it resolved as it caused issues on a different insurance policy that discovered the discrepancy - and it was my problem to resolve, not theirs!)
As has been mentioned, there are plenty of places that can either supply repair sections of body work and panels (Boss Motors and Banks have moulds for everything related to your TC) and even more that are capable of doing good quality repairs. Don’t just allow the insurance company to send it to their ‘approved bodyshop’ as you really need to insist it goes to a specialist that is familiar with both fibreglass repairs and Lotus cars. (Lots of TVR specialists out there that are pretty good with fibreglass repairs and paintwork for example and a fair few of them will be familiar with Lotus too). - don’t allow the insurance company to write it off as a total loss either.
I know that Richard @Banks used to do insurance repairs (he is a VERY good painter/body man himself) but I’m not sure if he’s still actively doing that sort of work - might be worth a call as he may be able to recommend someone if he isn’t doing it anymore?
Anything can be repaired, it generally looks far worse in the aftermath (coupled with being totally gutted at what some dumb a** has done to your pride and joy) but there’s no reason why it can’t be returned to as good as it was.
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I have used a company in Attleborough Norfolk to repair my fibreglass bodies. They are ex Lotus people.
https://attleborough.cylex-uk.co.uk/company/hardtops-direct-ltd-13720693.html
Tell them Alex recommended them. They have done all my 7 Europas.
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Thanks for the replies guys. On the insurance point I have been advised not to let a management company handle it as was suggested yesterday by the insurers . I have had another look at the car today and the rear impact pushed what is quite a flimsy boot tray with enough force to impact the alternator which is now slightly forward and offscew ,even the flexible hose on the original air box got all crumpled up as it too was forced onto the carb intake box. I cant see chassis damage but something has happened as there is about 9mm of play at the clutch release arm,whereas before the was just 2mm. Maybe the round bare hoop for the gearbox mounting is pushed forwwrd. The majority of the damage seems to the rear panel and does not go forward beyound the rear wheel arches, although the boot opening is now wider than before so something has bowed out.The car will never be the same to me, sure it can end up with a shiny coat of paint but its no longer the original undamaged shell as it left the factory. I do not feel like keeing it now.
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I really feel for you, its all our worst nightmare.
Do you have membership of Club Lotus as the help and advice is second to none (Apart from here of course). There are quite a reasonable amount of Classic lotus body repair specialists in the South of the UK and the repairs are done to a high standard. I understand how you feel but most Loti have picked up some body work damage over the years. Mine had a complete front corner replaced back in 1980 and it was virtually indistinguishable from new.
Spyder would be a good port of call I think as they have a skilled paint and body guy on site as well as their chassis expertise.
AFAIK Richard winter is a one man band now and other than tech advisor to lotus supplies etc he no longer takes on any direct work.
Good luck
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I have used a company in Attleborough Norfolk to repair my fibreglass bodies. They are ex Lotus people.
https://attleborough.cylex-uk.co.uk/company/hardtops-direct-ltd-13720693.html
Tell them Alex recommended them. They have done all my 7 Europas.
I have 2 spare engine covers, rear lights, and two spare rear bumpers, and if Hardtops Direct want to borrow a Europa to take a mould off, I am nearby.
Boss Motors near Sneterton can make the luggage trays. They are thicker fibreglass than the originals, and good quality.
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🥱😭 , OH NO.
I’m at a loss for words, except to say I’m glad no one was hurt.
Dakazman
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🥱😭 , OH NO.
I’m at a loss for words, except to say I’m glad no one was hurt.
Dakazman
having been in a couple shunts, both on 2 wheels and 4 wheels, this is the most important thing. I know, sounds trite, but it IS just a car and not worth a life.
Dig in, figure out what to do, assemble the troops, and march ahead. No, it will never be the same, pristine car you had. It could even conceivably be better...;)
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first thing is i hope you walked away with no injuries suv versus lotus you are lucky
as for insurance im insured with a classic car insurance they asked me if i had an evaluation of the value of my lotus if i had they would have based the price on that evaluation
she gave me three options
one evaluation two i say how much i want to insure it for or three go with market value of other lotus in similar condition the price is made according to that
when you got your insurance on the contract it should be written
good luck hope everything works out ok
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Really sorry to hear this but it sounds like you weren't injured so good news there.
I would say get it repaired, I have nearly finished a TC restoration using a new shell from
Boss Motors (that's how I bought the car)
To be completely honest, the mouldings and panel fits were terrible and took months of work to get
right. The PO had worked on the body, but I think he gave up and sold the car. You will be much better off
getting a new rear end grafted on, it may look hopeless but in reality it's a pretty simple job.
As the saying goes, perfection is the enemy of good.....
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Very sorry to hear this news. This is just terrible. Wishing you the best of luck with the insurance, and getting things sorted.
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It has been pointed out to me that I should not have to accept a repair which is worse than pre accident. If you had an undamaged car next to a damaged but repaired car, Im certain which one would be less desirable and have less value. With a rare classic such as this there is no good reason why I should settle for second best, well this was the advice from a friend anyway.
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I don't think anyone should accept any repair that is worse than pre-accident. However with glass fibre repairs especially this is nearly always obvious to a pro. I wouldn't rush any decision yet. As an aside does your registration end in 393L?
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My fibreglass repairs are stronger than the original shell.
You cannot tell from the outside.
From the inside, they just look thicker.
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My fibreglass repairs are stronger than the original shell.
You cannot tell from the outside.
From the inside, they just look thicker.
Totally agree. To follow on from my earlier post, if you were happy with the car as it was before the crash, get it repaired.
You will be unlikely to find a replacement that matches up to your expectations considering the time you have put into it and the level
of finish you are happy with.
I made a mistake 30 years ago, restored a TC Special and crashed it hard within a month. It sat in bits for years as I got too despondent about
it. Finally sold it for crap money just to get it out of my sight. In reality I should have been far more sanguine and just got on and repaired it.
But, your car, your call....
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The most important thing is that you are ok...
Take heart, and if you really feel that all the work you've put in prior to the accident was wasted...
Think it over again, never make a decision when you are upset. It may take some time and hassle with the settlement but, in the long run you will have the satisfaction of making her roadworthy again.
ps...post a pic of the damage, it may help us understand your challenge going forward.
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One of the things I dislike about recent pickup trucks and SUVs is the trend towards abominable forward visibility. You can easily hide a Lotus Europa (or a toddler) in the blind spot in front many new SUVs. It seems like the trend is driven by fashion rather than any functional concern, so that's makes it feel more frustrating that it is creating an unnecessary new danger. I've attached a picture of a 2022 Chevy Silverado with guesstimate of the lower limit of the forward vision to illustrate what I'm on about.
Maybe a flag at eye level would make the car harder to miss. Something like the flags they sell for recumbent bikes. Not cool though :-[
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I'm reminded of those 9 foot antennas people sported during the CB craze in the '70's
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A buddy of mine has strapped an orange bicycle pennant to his Lotus 7 roll bar. That might be a good idea but you'll have to be creative with how and where to mount it keeping in mind if it is too high, it will just blow over when you get going.
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You can get some really cool lit up whip sticks in the SXS world. They use them for night riding in the sand dunes and such.
https://www.amazon.ca/Krator-Multi-Color-Remote-Control-American/dp/B07XF1RCF2/ref=asc_df_B07XF1RCF2/?tag=googleshopc0c-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=335328731510&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=7490772486389660148&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9001494&hvtargid=pla-818890727920&psc=1
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Or do like Frank Costin did with the Amigo.
It's a very low car and apparently when developing the prototype in Wales he thought folks wouldn't see the car as it was lower than the stone walls lining the roads. So he fitted a pylon with a light.... strange but true, it's quoted in his book.
Brian
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I'm so sorry to hear your news. Gutting to have that happen
Good luck with the whole insurance process….not sure I can add anything else ref insurance
I have a high (ish) level brake light on the very rear edge of the roof. Sourced from one of the later MG's with the K series engine….TF, an LED number and I keep my foot on the brake until I see I've been clocked….or hope I have
The pylon would be effective…..maybe an air intake for cold and the third brake like on the back of that
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High mounted brake light? Pshaw!
I'm fitting a tail gunner...
(https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/wwii-b17-tail-gun-14345019.jpg)
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:I-agree: :FUNNY:
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I suppose it's one of the few reasons to mount a "Circuit Wolf" rear spoiler, just so you can get a high level rear brake light more "in yer face"....
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Picture of the high (ish) level brake light
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Nice. How hard was it to fit to the top edge there? What is its vertical dimension?
I looked all over for something that would fit there a while back, but gave up. Now, eBay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/MG-TF-HIGH-LEVEL-BOOT-BRAKE-LIGHT-ASSEMBLY-XFG000051-BRAND-NEW-GENUINE-/142120198668 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/MG-TF-HIGH-LEVEL-BOOT-BRAKE-LIGHT-ASSEMBLY-XFG000051-BRAND-NEW-GENUINE-/142120198668)
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....i must have mis remembered that doesn't look right....i'm so sorry
Leave it with me I'll dig out my old records and take measurements. The PO did it. I'll email him and see if he can recollect
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https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/392472459207?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338268676&toolid=10044&customid=EAIaIQobChMIqLOH-p39-AIVCbrtCh3SIwmdEAQYCyABEgI-IPD_BwE
I will measure up tonight and post dimensions but this looks very similar
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That does look better. The one I linked is curved across the front, which wouldn’t match the roof edge very well.
BTW, sorry for the slight derail. Considering all of the rear ended Europas, I think a third brake light is a good addition, if it can be done cleanly.
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I also added a 3rd high LED brake light. $15 Canadian plus wire tied into the rear brake circuit. Siliconed in place for easy removal for when I do a repaint.
Sandy