Lotus Europa Community
Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: BDA on Friday,July 02, 2021, 11:30:53 AM
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I'll very likely be in the market for a new set of a shocks so I'm wondering which shocks you guys prefer. (as an aside, I have to say that I find it amazing that there are so many manufacturers that make shocks for such an old and low production car!)
I currently have SPAX shocks that I got a long time ago. The worst part of that is that I don't know how many clicks of adjustment mine have. The SPAX tech guy told me that his best guess is that they have either 8 or 16 clicks. A SPAX tech guy also told me that turning the stiffness higher or lower than the allowable clicks will break them and it wasn't confidence inspiring when he said I might feel very little resistance when going above or below the allowable adjustments so for all I know, I may have broken them already!
I'll be using them for fast road driving so rubber bushes are fine and probably preferable for cost reasons. I want adjustable spring perches and adjustable stiffness. I also have higher than stock spring rates. So what shocks do you all prefer? I realize it's unlikely but if you have experience with more than one brand, I'd especially like to hear your story. I'd also like to know where you got them.
I'd appreciate any information you can give me!
Thanks!
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When my SPAX''s went again. I went with Protech aluminum ones. You can buy them direct (U.K.) or from SJ Sportscars. Have only had them a couple of years, but very pleased.
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Thanks, Swift. I saw them but they only listed them with springs. Do they just sell bare shocks?
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I had Spax adjustables some years ago and they were good. When they finally wore out I fitted AVO's, Richard Winter's recommendation and they were far superior! Suppleness and compliance in a different league,
but with the same adjustability and spring height options. I can put the Europa into high speed turns with complete confidence. Great shox and I will replace with the same when needed.
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Thanks for that, europa88! I assume you got the "adjustable and uprated" ones?
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Another vote for AVO's...
Called Richard at Banks and got the up rated set w/ springs. Although expensive and with the exchange rate it was well worth the money. Vic also runs them on 3522R and I can confirm to their predictability...soft or stiff, the feedback is excellent.
My initial concern on 3007R was the stance and height of the original Armstrong units, after fitting the up rated set I was very pleased with the ride and response.
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Good to hear, Lou. Out of curiosity, do you know what spring rates Richard gave you?
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Thanks for that, europa88! I assume you got the "adjustable and uprated" ones?
Yes adjustable and uprated. 20 Clicks for adjustment. I run 7 from softest on the fronts and 5 from softest on the rear for road use and 9 front 7 rear for general track use. I really couldn't recommend them enough.
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Protech from sjs. They are excellent. Front spring 250#/inch. Rear stock spring.
Good price as well.
Good luck.
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Thanks europa88 and Pfreen!
It’s really interesting to me how many different combinations of spring rates people use!
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Good to hear, Lou. Out of curiosity, do you know what spring rates Richard gave you?
I will check my records, I know they were PF554 & CD121 AVO numbers...the boxes were marked "Banks Special"...
I will search the AVO UK master list on line when I get a chance later.
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Thanks, Lou. I emailed Lotus Supplies and asked them what their spring rates were but they didn’t seem to be able to tell me. Maybe Richard is the only one who knows!
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Hi there,
As you know I have the Protech dampers on the Europa, bought from SJS although there are other options. On the Elan I have AVO as recommended by Pat Thomas from Kelvedon.
Both are excellent compared with what passed for the Lotus spec dampers as sourced by specialist dealers in the 80s/90s. I couldn't honestly rate one above the other although I think the biggest impression I had was from the Elan, that is firm but very nice to drive from the first test run. But I did have Pat telling me where to set everything so that makes a massive difference compared with trial & error on the Europa.
Take a look at both manufacturer's websites, you'll get so much detail your head will spin.....
Protech : https://www.protechshocks.co.uk/build-a-shock/ (https://www.protechshocks.co.uk/build-a-shock/)
AVO : http://www.avouk.com/Products_TWIN_TUBE_APPLICATIONS_A-L.htm#LOTUS
The AVO link is for their recommendations, if you search about their site you'll find open/closed/travel dimensions, etc. IIRC both make rebuildable dampers although I doubt I'd be bothered to go that route.
Brian
PS - on the Elise I fitted Bilstein in place of the original Koni dampers. The Konis lasted under 10k before the rears leaked, it didn't even make the first MoT (3yrs) although they did manage to pass the warranty period back then. I guess the lesson from that is not to buy on the name and past glories, the Bilsteins, even though non-adjustable, give a great ride compared with the OEM Konis. I think Lotus adopted them for the S2 ?
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BDA: I have Spax on the front (150 lb springs) and Proctechs in the rear (115 lb springs).
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Thanks Brian and literarymadness! I appreciate the input but I can’t say anybody has made my decision much easier! At the moment, it seems like it’s between AVO and Protech. I have to say that the Protechs look really pretty! :)
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I would talk to Richard and see what spring rates he recommends for your specific application and desires. I happily went with the AVO shocks and requested springs in the stock rate and length. I don't do track days very often and I'm very happy with the ride on local roads -- while decidedly pre-apocalyptic, they are maintained to post-apocalyptic standards.
I do not think you would be unhappy with either choice. The key is in the set-up advice you will get from your supplier.
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Thanks, JB. The funny thing is that Richard suggested 250#/130# to me back when I was building my car and I shave not been able to get comfortable with them. It’s possible that my old SPAX shocks could have been part of the problem. I’m now experimenting with springs similar to what Certified Lotus liked so well (160#/115#). There is certainly nothing wrong with the handling of a stock Europa, though, and I’ll remember your comment about road quality in case I end up lowering the rates further.
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I don't know AVO or SPAX but I know old konis. Konis had to be removed to adjust. The Protec dampers are really easy to adjust. A knob that is easily accessible with the spring installed.
When you order, don't forget the spring perch wrench.
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Thanks Pfreen. Early in my rebuilding my car, I bought and intended to use Konis. At that time, they were the trick shock for just about all cars but then I heard about SPAX and with stiffness AND ride height adjustment the SPAX were a better option so I sold the Konis. At that time I don't think I was aware of any other options - it was pre-Internet. Now there are lots of options!
Don't worry, I'll buy a spring perch wrench for whatever shocks I get.
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One shock brand not mentioned is Gaz. I have a set ready to install on my TCS when its ready for the road. No experience with the Gaz on the road so I can't comment on the ride qualities. They appear to be very well built compared to the Spax shocks that look like Konis from the mid 80s. I'm running 120# front, 160#rears.
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Grumblebuns, those are interesting spring rates. I’ve heard of people using Gaz shocks but I don’t know what they thought about them. I expect they probably are well built and good shocks but it would be nice to hear about some experiences. When you get your TCS on the road, let us know how it drives and handles.
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Grumblebuns, I hesitate speaking ill of another’s purchase but I was recently alerted to the problem a Gaz owner had and thought since it is a potential safety issue I thought I should. You might want to check out this link (https://arc.seloc.org/viewthread.php?tid=403317&page=1#pid6870544%3Cbr). That points to another Lotus forum and you will probably have to join it (for free) to view the posts.
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Hey BDA, thanks for the link. First time I heard of a shock failure from a broken shock mount eye. I'm not terribly worried since the incident happened 8 years ago. Its just something to keep an eye on as part of my normal inspection. I had a quality control issue with a rear Spax on my TCS (since sold). The rubber bush that is suppose to be bonded to the lower mount eye, wasn't. Over time the lower shock mounting point shift over almost coming off the rubber bush. The first time it happened, I caught it in time before the shock came completely off the bolt. I had to add a large washer to keep the mount in place.
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A big washer in places like that is always a good idea.
One would think that they might consider a design modification by now and your Europa shocks may not be subject to the same design flaw so you're probably ok, especially if you watch out for it. I don't know if you read many of the posts but one guy said both front springs of his Vauxhaul broke! He claims he didn't abuse or otherwise drive it roughly or harsh conditions. I'll be that wasn't a fun ride!
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Despite Richard's recommendation of #250 front springs I would differ if you're after a smooth ride and haven't dropped your ride height a lot. I run 250/175 on my Protech's, but my car is lowered dramatically. I used to do a lot of trackdays and I don't mind a stiff ride. Something in the 180/ 120 # neighborhood sound about right if you want a balance between smooth ride and handling.
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I have to say, that I didn't mind the ride when I had 250/130 springs. I did have a problem with uneven pavement and it felt nervous (i.e. it felt like a very small steering input would catapult the car into the next lane or further) even with my shocks set near the max stiffness. Now those shocks were probably deficient and better shocks might have made everything better. That's the reason for my interest in what shocks people like.