Lotus Europa Community
Lotus Europa Forums => Garage => Topic started by: TCS4605R on Thursday,July 09, 2020, 03:11:35 PM
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I have been talking with Dave at Lotus-Supplies in England regarding CV joint flanges to fit the output shafts of the 365 transaxle. I'm planning to convert to CV joints at both ends of each half shaft. Dave says Richard does not stock these any more but will make them for 500 to 550 British pounds per set - this is $630 to $693 at today's exchange rate. If anyone is interested, Richard may get the price down if we have enough demand - anyone interested?
Tom
74 TCS - 4605R
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Did you notice my post June 23 and Private message Tom? Photos of pair of CV flanges to Renault splines $400.
Dave Miller
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http://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=3828.msg40618#msg40618
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Dave - I did see your email. I have also been talking with Richard about having him supply the half shafts and stub axles for the CV joint conversion for a complete system less the new upper link that I can make.
Tom
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Interesting. Would that be his stub axle with a UJ, or a stub axle using a CVJ?
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Andy - I'm looking for a stub axle with a CV joint flange.
Tom
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That would be nice - a "drop-in" kit from Richard. Have you any indication that he's interested in producing some?
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Andy,
Still talking with Dave at Lotus Supplies. Would you or anyone else be interested?
Tom
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I would probably be interested somewhere down the line but I'm not able to do anything for a while. I am anxious to have a proper hardened stub axle though.
I have a spare set of internal CV Joints. I wonder if the splines could be cut off and welded to some VW CV Joint flanges and make a straight VW setup from there?
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I probably would have considered a Banks "drop in kit" if it was available when I started my project. As it stands, I have all the parts, and have done most of the fettling, I think, using the VW bits. The VW bits are inexpensive, durable. I know of one conversion that was done that worked out. I purchased the Banks NG3 CVJ output flanges as I was purchasing a NG3 from him, and it was easier than chasing that down and having them done here.
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Looking more closely at Dave's CV joint setup, it appears to be what I was thinking about. The splined "collars" from a Renault CV joint are cut off and welded to a VW or some more generic flange. Using VW CV joints there allows you to use VW parts for most of the rest which means you'd have double CV joints but more importantly, stronger stub axles.
Now, if there was a way to get just the splined "collars"...
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If I recall, Richard Mann used an early BMW 2002 stub axle and Alfetta drive shafts with an adaptor to the BMW stub.
I wonder if the BMW stub axle is compatible with a VW CV joint?
I don't know what he used for the transaxle output flange.
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I think you're right. He is credited with the design on the Lotus Europa Central page (http://www.lotus-europa.com/manuals/index.htm#suspensn). I might note that there is also a Corvair stub axle conversion but I suspect they are probably a bit harder to find.
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BMW does use the same type Lobro CV joint as VW, however I believe there are 3 different size Lobro joints.
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Why re-invent the wheel ? (no pun intended) Spyder Cars already supply a kit to do this as do Kelvedon Lotus. Sue Miller has a double CV joint conversion for the Elan and possibly the Europa and don't forget the Renault Fuego had a double CV joint set up as it was front wheel drive so the shafts did both the drive and steering.
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Brian, could you please post some links. I didn't find CV joints at either Spyder or Kelvedon - though I will admit that I cannot always find products that Kelvedon sells such as their stub axles.
Since the Elan is Ford based, I think their CV joint solution is not transferable to the Renault based Europa.
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Spyder's optional A arm rear suspension with their own uprights and driveshafts (doughnut + U joint) only fits a Spyder frame. I'm not finding a Kelvedon CV driveshaft/rear suspension on their website.
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Richard Mann had purchased some VW bits to make up a conversion. I don't know if he has progressed, as he doesn't seem to post here often, and I think he was working on his 47 car.
He wrote up his CVJ conversion to his S2 here http://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=1724.0 (http://www.lotuseuropa.org/LotusForum/index.php?topic=1724.0)
Pic is of VW beetle transaxle CVJ flanges
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I looked at the thread about Richard Mann's rear suspension mods and from what I can understand, the interior CV Joint is from an Alfa Alfetta. That is very interesting! I'm writing him about any details he can share about that.
I've posted some pictures of the CV joints I bought from Richard. Unfortunately, the parts were wrapped in duct tape many years ago and taking it off left a fair amount of goo so you'll have to look past that goo and my poor photography. The first two pictures are of the main, outside piece and the third is the interior piece where the axle splines would mate. The splined collar fits over the output shaft of my NG3 and I believe any other Renault tranny a Europa owner would likely have. The offset hole for a roll pint also matches up with the output shaft. So, as I described earlier, one plan might be to cut that collar off that CV joint and weld it onto a "generic" or VW CV joint flange. I believe what SwiftDB4 posted a picture of is something just like that.
Using a VW CV joint flange would, I think, allow you to replace the rest of the drive shaft parts with VW parts - although there might be some massaging necessary. I would experiment with stub axles if I had a junk rear upright I could test fit with. Someone???
It might also be that BMW parts would fit too but there are lots of VW parts to choose from. For example, drive shafts come in one inch increments, stub axles are hardened and all are well made, readily available, and economical. Also, all the splines would immediately match up.
That's at least my initial plan. If someone has some concerns or ideas for alternates, I'd love to hear them!
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BMW does use the same type Lobro CV joint as VW, however I believe there are 3 different size Lobro joints.
Yes, 94mm, 100mm and 108mm.
BMW 2002 tii used Lobro style 100mm CV's.
From what I gather, they're spline compatible with VW axles of the same era.
I doubt there's a need to go to the larger Porsche 930 type 108mm CV's.
Older 94mm CV's are probably perfectly adequate, but not so well supported these days.